Australia in the World

Ep. 120: Where to from ”stabilisation” in Australia-China relations?

PM Albanese’s visit to Beijing has ended. Are Australia-China relations “stabilised”? And if so, what’s next? To discuss these big questions Darren is joined by Ben Herscovitch, his colleague at the ANU and author of the indispensable Substack newsletter “Beijing to Canberra and Back”.

Relevant links

Ben Herscovitch, “The Prime Minister's visit, what really caused relationship repair, and a policy takeaway”, Beijing to Canberra and Back, 30 October to 7 November 2023: https://beijing2canberra.substack.com/p/the-prime-ministers-visit-what-really

Ben Herscovitch, “Australia should sanction Chinese officials abusing human rights”, Canberra Times, 7 November 2023: https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/8413517/no-escaping-an-uncomfortable-fact-about-pms-handling-of-china/

Darren Lim and Walter Colnaghi, “Allan Gyngell's podcasting contribution to Australian foreign policy”, Australian Journal of International Affairs, 7 November 2023: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/10357718.2023.2272825

Yiruma, “River flows in you” (video): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7maJOI3QMu0  N

NASA, "Pale blue dot" (image): https://science.nasa.gov/resource/voyager-1s-pale-blue-dot/ 

Jurassic Park (Film): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jurassic_Park_(film)

Ep. 121: Reviewing 2023; speculating about 2024

Continuing a tradition of podcast, for the first episode back from a long summer break Darren is joined by good friend of the podcast Richard Maude to discuss what each learned from 2023, what trends were notable, and what we might expect – or hope for – in 2024. The discussion covers both the world, and Australia in the world, and the two are able to agree on the ‘word of the year’ for 2023: fragmentation.

Australia in the World is written, hosted, and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing this episode by Walter Colnaghi and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Richard Maude biography: https://asiasociety.org/policy-institute/richard-maude

Secretary Antony J. Blinken Remarks to the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies (SAIS) “The Power and Purpose of American Diplomacy in a New Era”, 13 September 2023: https://www.state.gov/secretary-antony-j-blinken-remarks-to-the-johns-hopkins-school-of-advanced-international-studies-sais-the-power-and-purpose-of-american-diplomacy-in-a-new-era/

Wang Yi speech at a symposium on the international situation and China's foreign relations in 2023, summarised in Xinhua piece: https://english.news.cn/20240109/f8a95bbb328642c1b11c05fb409bff9d/c.html?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

Josh Rogin, Chaos Under heaven (Goodreads page): https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/54562943

Lawrence Durrell, Bitter Lemons of Cyprus (Goodreads page): https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/214948

Tracy Chapman and Luke Coombs, “Fast Car”, 2024 Grammys (video): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEqb6xbeuCo

Ep. 119: When domestic policy is foreign policy (and the PM’s travels)

The ABC’s Stephen Dziedzic joins once again this episode. PM Albanese is visiting China later this week, and Darren frames a new bargaining phase of the relationship, in which both sides (but especially Australia) must manage multiple, complex, and cross-cutting equities. He imagines a ‘ledger’ of ‘wins’ for both sides, and the discussion revolves around what might lie behind some of the recent policy decisions made by the government that appear favourable to Beijing’s interests, such as Darwin port and anti-dumping duties.

The PM has also just returned from a state visit to Washington DC, and so Darren and Stephen discuss the prospects of AUKUS getting through congress, the extent to which there are differences between the Biden Administration and the Albanese government on China, and some other interesting details from a speech delivered by the PM. Stephen then discusses his recent article with Lice Movono on the Fijian government reversing an apparent decision to join a statement criticising China on human rights. The podcast concludes touching upon the fact that Stephen just spent the past week sitting in senate estimates hearings – for what purpose, and what did he learn?

Australia in the World is written, hosted, and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing this episode by Corbin Duncan and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Stephen Dziedzic, “Why did Beijing choose this moment to release Cheng Lei, and what might it signify?”, ABC News, 13 October 2023: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-10-13/cheng-lei-analysis-xiao-qian-beijing-albanese-visit/102972204

Stephen Dziedzic, “Federal government will not cancel Chinese company Landbridge's Port of Darwin lease”, ABC News, 20 October 2023: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-10-20/port-of-darwin-chinese-company-lease-not-cancelled/103003452

Stephen Dziedzic and Lice Movono, “Fiji to withdraw name from list of nations criticising China's human rights violations of Uyghur and Muslim minorities”, ABC News, 27 October 2023: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-10-27/fiji-backs-united-nations-china-human-rights-violations-xinjiang/103025888

Evan Osnos, “China’s age of malaise”, The New Yorker, 23 October 2023: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2023/10/30/chinas-age-of-malaise

Jonathan Jones, Earthly Delights: A History of the Renaissance (Thames and Hudson, 2023): https://thamesandhudson.com.au/product/earthly-delights-a-history-of-the-renaissance/  

Ep. 118: A US perspective on Australia’s defence policy

Almost six months have passed since the release of the Defence Strategic Review (DSR), and this episode Darren is joined by Zack Cooper, Senior Fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, for an American perspective on Australia’s defence policy. The conversation starts with a basic conceptual model and fundamental tensions with Australia’s alliance with the US, before traversing a range of contemporary issues, including AUKUS, the possible re-election of Donald Trump and battlefield lessons from Ukraine.

Australia in the World is written, hosted, and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing by Corbin Duncan and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Zack Cooper, biography: https://www.aei.org/profile/zack-cooper/

Department of Defence, “National Defence: Defence Strategic Review 2023”, April 2023: https://www.defence.gov.au/about/reviews-inquiries/defence-strategic-review

Institute for the Study of War: https://www.understandingwar.org/

Binge Mode: Harry Potter (podcast): https://podbay.fm/p/binge-mode-harry-potter  

Ep. 117: Canada-India (emergency episode)

In an 'emergency' episode, Darren is joined by Ian Hall, a Professor at the Griffith Asia Institute, to discuss the truly explosive revelation made this week by PM Trudeau of Canada that Canadian authorities are pursuing allegations linking agents backed by the Indian government to the murder of a Sikh separatist leader (who was a Canadian citizen) on Canadian soil in June. 

Noting this story is still in its early days, Ian describes the complex and troubled history and context to this incident, before the two think through the perspectives of the Indian and Canadian governments, and how third countries like Australia might approach the path forward. 

Australia in the World is written, hosted and produced by Darren Lim, with editing by Walter Colnaghi and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Ep. 116: Australia’s international development policy

The Australian government has launched a new International Development Policy, and Darren is joined by Bridi Rice, CEO of the Development Intelligence Lab, for a discussion of all things development through an Australian lens. The conversation begins with some Development 101: what is “development? What are the goals of development policy and are they contested? How is development policy carried out in practice, and by whom? Bridi describes Australia’s development policy community as coming out of a decade in a “defensive crouch” and provides an overview of the new policy. The conversation ranges widely, including a focus on geopolitics and China and the question of how a development policy can place a climate change agenda at its core.

Australia in the World is written, hosted and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing by Corbin Duncan and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Bridi Rice, biography: https://www.devintelligencelab.com/team/bridi-rice

Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, “Australia’s International Development Policy”, August 2023: https://www.dfat.gov.au/development/new-international-development-policy  

Eryk Bagshaw, “Ransom attack cripples Vanuatu government systems, forces staff to use pen and paper”, Sydney Morning Herald, 14 November 2022: https://www.smh.com.au/world/oceania/australia-called-in-to-help-after-hackers-shut-down-vanuatu-government-systems-20221114-p5by7a.html

Pat Conroy, Audience Q&A, Development Policy Forum, Australian National University, 12 September 2023: https://ministers.dfat.gov.au/minister/pat-conroy/transcript/audience-qa-development-policy-forum-australian-national-university

Stefan Dercon, Gambling on Development: Why Some Countries Win and Others Lose (2022):  https://www.amazon.com/Gambling-Development-Some-Countries-Others/dp/1787385620

Gambling on development, reviewed: https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/lsereviewofbooks/2022/09/14/book-review-gambling-on-development-why-some-countries-win-and-others-lose-by-stefan-dercon/

Gambling on development, presented to an Australian audience at ANU:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3mNwbNDoPg

Hania Rani (musician and composer): https://haniarani.com

Bluey The Album: https://www.bluey.tv/products/bluey-the-album/

Ep. 115: The domestic politics of AUKUS and Pacific security pacts

This episode Darren is thrilled to be joined (for the second time) by Stephen Dziedzic of the ABC, perhaps the finest foreign affairs reporter in Australia and a dear friend of the podcast. While the episode commences with the premise of ‘stories that are bubbling beneath the surface’, over time a clear theme emerges – the domestic politics of security pacts. The conversation begins with a new agreement between Papua New Guinea and the United States that seems to be delaying Canberra’s efforts to conclude its own pact with Port Morseby. Next up is Vanuatu, where Australia was (surprisingly) able to procure the signing of a new security agreement when a new government took office last year, but which is now facing strong ratification headwinds. Meanwhile in Australia, grassroots discontent within the ruling Labor Party regarding AUKUS threatened to overflow at the party’s annual conference this past week. The majority of the podcast was recorded on 11 August, with a quick postscript recorded on 20 August. 

Australia in the World is written, hosted and produced by Darren Lim, with research and editing by Walter Colnaghi and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Kenneth Clarke, Civilisation (TV series): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX_r9R98DiY

Empire (podcast): https://www.goalhangerpodcasts.com/battleground-copy

China Power (podcast), ‘China’s Influence in Melanesia: A Conversation with Pete Connolly’, 2 August 2023: https://www.csis.org/podcasts/chinapower/chinas-influence-melanesia-conversation-pete-connolly

Richard Kerbaj, The Secret History of the Five Eyes: The Untold Story of the International Spy Network (review): https://www.theguardian.com/books/2022/oct/02/the-secret-history-of-the-five-eyes-untold-story-international-spy-network-by-richard-kerbaj-review

Henry Reynolds, Truth-Telling: History, sovereignty and the Uluru Statement, NewSouth Books: https://www.newsouthbooks.com.au/books/truth-telling/

Ep. 114: And we’re back. Australia-China; US-China

It’s time to resume, or start again. A lot has happened in the past four months, and Darren focuses on two big stories, or relationship trajectories: Australia-China, and US-China. Both might be trending in positive directions, but there have been bumps along the way.

May the same be said for this podcast into the future!

Australia in the World is written and produced by Darren Lim, with research, editing and co-hosting this episode by Walter Colnaghi, and theme music composed by Rory Stenning.

Relevant links

Penny Wong, “Meeting with China’s Director of the Office of the Central Commission for Foreign Affairs Wang Yi - Opening remarks”, 13 July 2023: https://www.foreignminister.gov.au/minister/penny-wong/speech/meeting-chinas-director-office-central-commission-foreign-affairs-wang-yi-opening-remarks

Alan Tidwell, “The role of ‘diplomatic lobbying’ in shaping US foreign policy and its effects on the Australia–US relationship”, Australian Journal of International Affairs, 2017: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/10357718.2016.1184620

Celebrating the Life of Allan Gyngell AO, 19 June 1947 - 3 May 2023 (video): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ej7i_0bqVNM

Leonard Cohen, “Come healing”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pKUwTooZ3o

DPM Richard Marles’ statement ot the House of Representatives, 10 May 2023: https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Hansard/Hansard_Display?bid=chamber/hansardr/26693/&sid=0002

Video (see from 9:01:20am): https://www.aph.gov.au/News_and_Events/Watch_Read_Listen/ParlView/video/1108170

FM Penny Wong’s statement to the Senate, 10 May 2023: https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Hansard/Hansard_Display?bid=chamber/hansards/26728/&sid=0055

Video (see from 12:19:40): https://www.aph.gov.au/News_and_Events/Watch_Read_Listen/ParlView/video/1108162

Tim Watts, “Remarks in memory of Allan Gyngell AO”, 11 May 2023: https://ministers.dfat.gov.au/minister/tim-watts/statements/remarks-memory-allan-gyngell-ao

Alan Bollard, Economists at war (book): https://global.oup.com/academic/product/economists-at-war-9780198846000?cc=au&lang=en&

Rick Astley and Blossoms perform the songs of The Smiths at Glastonbury 2023 (youtube, but audio only): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ6KiHIWnFk

Allan Gyngell and Australia in the world

Allan Gyngell passed away on 3 May 2023. Darren talks about the past few weeks, and reads a short piece he wrote for the AIIA about his friend, and the podcast they built together.

Relevant links

Darren Lim, “Allan Gyngell and ‘Australia in the World’”, 5 May 2023: https://www.internationalaffairs.org.au/australianoutlook/allan-gyngell-and-australia-in-the-world/

Penny Wong, “Passing of Allan Gyngell AO”, 3 May 2023: https://www.foreignminister.gov.au/minister/penny-wong/media-release/passing-allan-gyngell-ao

Daniel Flitton, “Remembering Allan Gyngell, ‘the finest mind in Australian foreign policy’”, Lowy Interpreter, 3 May 2023: https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/remembering-allan-gyngell-finest-mind-australian-foreign-policy

Andrew Tillett, “Allan Gyngell remembered as ‘finest mind’ in foreign policy”, Australian Financial Review, 3 May 2023: https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/allan-gyngell-remembered-as-finest-mind-in-foreign-policy-20230503-p5d599  

Peter Varghese, “Vale Allan Gyngell AO”, Asialink, 3 May 2023: https://asialink.unimelb.edu.au/stories/vale-allan-gyngell-ao

John Blaxland, “Vale Allan Gyngell: A remarkable contributor to Australia’s engagement with the world”, The Conversation, 4 May 2023: https://www.themandarin.com.au/219276-allan-gyngell-a-contributor-to-australias-world-engagement/

Kevin Rudd, “Statement on the death of Allan Gyngell AO”, 3 May 2023: https://www.kevinrudd.com/media/statement-on-the-death-of-allan-gyngell-ao

Ludovico Einaudi, i giorni (youtube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TL1v3KVi6go

George Winston, Variations on the Kanon (youtube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2CE5BZVk40

Ep. 112: Cold War 2?

In the wake of Xi Jinping’s trip to Moscow to meet Vladimir Putin, Allan and Darren ask – are we in a new Cold War? Is the concept a useful frame for understanding international affairs?

We thank Walter Colnaghi for research and audio editing and Rory Stenning for composing our theme music.

Relevant links

“Dr Heather Smith to become National President of the Australian Institute of International Affairs”, AIIA Press release, 17 November 2022: https://www.internationalaffairs.org.au/news-item/dr-heather-smith-to-become-national-president-of-the-australian-institute-of-international-affairs/

George Orwell, “You and the atom bomb”, 1945: https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwell/essays-and-other-works/you-and-the-atom-bomb/

Aaron Friedberg, “Why didn’t the United States become a Garrison State” (article): https://www.jstor.org/stable/2539189

Aaron Friedberg, In the shadow of the Garrison State (book): https://press.princeton.edu/books/paperback/9780691048901/in-the-shadow-of-the-garrison-state  

“ChinaTalk: Stephen Kotkin on China” (podcast), 23 March 2023: https://www.lawfareblog.com/chinatalk-stephen-kotkin-china

George Kennan, “The long telegram” (1946): https://nsarchive2.gwu.edu/coldwar/documents/episode-1/kennan.htm

“Speech by President von der Leyen on EU-China relations to the Mercator Institute for China Studies and the European Policy Centre”, 30 March 2023: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/speech_23_2063

John Lewis Gaddis, The Long Peace (book): https://global.oup.com/academic/product/the-long-peace-9780195043358?cc=au&lang=en&

Odd Arne Westad, The Global Cold War (book): https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/global-cold-war/75870878657DC67E0BC70FA7D2388494

Darren Lim and John Ikenberry, “China and the logic of illiberal hegemony”, Security Studies (temporary free download): https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/HGZEHMIG6URDFUCTYCCN/full?target=10.1080/09636412.2023.2178963

Darren Lim and John Ikenberry, “China and the logic of illiberal hegemony”, Ungated paper: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4244377

John Lewis Gaddis, George F Kennan: An American Life (book): https://www.pulitzer.org/winners/john-lewis-gaddis

Norah Jones (Wikipedia page): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norah_Jones